Paul: Tell me how - you were in East Germany at the end of World War II, what became East Germany after everything was divvied up. How did you get to the United States?

Volker: Well, we have to go back to 1946, one year after the war. The year didn't count, so I should have gone to high school in 1946. However, as the son of a capitalist, that path was blocked. A capitalist was any businessman. You might have had a woodworking shop or an automobile dealership, or you could've had a garden center. You couldn't go to high school. So how to get to high school?

Fortunately for me and for many others, the 4 powers - the United States, Great Britain, Russia and France - agreed that everybody could go back to where they lived before the war, before 1939. So, I was lucky enough that on a rainy day, I walked in back of our house, and strolled across our lawn.

I must say that our house was ransacked. We had left the house in order to survive, and the Germans - not Russians, Germans had ransacked the house and scattered all sorts of papers on the back lawn. There in the rain - soaked, I found my report card from 1st grade from Munich in West Germany. That saved my skin.

With that - armed with that report card, I could take a train to the border. We walked across. I was one of many. And legally crossed over into West Germany into the British zone. And it was quite an experience. The very first thing in the refugee center, we were deloused. Never mind if we had lice. We were deloused, and then faced a number of officials who checked on us to see if we were truly residents or future residents of West Germany. Yes, I was.

So, I first stayed with 2 aunts in Hanover, in the British zone. Where by the way, I saw my first British troops. They were very neat and formal. And they were a wonder to behold, after living under the Russian occupation for a year. So, from Hanover, I took a train. A train to Munich, which is about 455 hundred miles.

It took several days, because Hitler had given the order to detonate all bridges. So, I would take a train from Hanover to points south. The train would go, say 40 miles, and everybody had to stop because there was a bridge out. You would go on a bus. The bus would go down through the valley. And you would come up on the other side and take a train back to the tracks, and eventually I made it to Munich. I think it took 3 or 4 days.

What I remember vividly was sleeping in, on the floor in the train station. And I had all my belongings in a seaman's bag. And the seaman's bag was my pillow. And that bag had a long, long cord which I wrapped around my middle - just in case somebody - while I was sleeping, would try to steal my belongings.

Okay, the porter tells me I only have a minute here. Anyway, I made it to Munich, I encountered no problems. And I had - at the border, I had received ration cards, a train ticket to Munich, a picture ID. I realized I had not just shaken off the Russian occupation but that I had entered an area of freedom. Seeing the first British uniforms was a revelation. At the time it was less a feeling of freedom, but the knowledge that I would now most likely survive and lead a normal life. Those thoughts were overshadowed by getting into high school, catching up on what had happened in the West since the end of the war, and last but not least, securing enough food to survive. Believe it or not food was a constant on everybody’s mind.  Not just mine.

The West German state was wonderful. I got into high school. I spent 4 years in high school and graduated in 1950. And in the same month, I received a scholarship to study in the United States. I had won the lottery.

Paul: And I'm sure as heck glad you did, otherwise I might be speaking Russian right now.

Volker: Yes.

Paul: At some point the writing was on the wall, right? Anyone with half a brain knew that you couldn’t fight the Russians and the western allies, including the United States, at the same time. Did people openly resist?

Volker: Yes, there was quiet opposition, quiet opposition. If you officially fought the regime, you knew you would lose your head. So, it was a quiet opposition. You do not - you could only talk openly and criticize the Nazis in your immediate family, with your immediate family. And you had to be extremely careful. You lived in 2 worlds….

Paul: Let me ask you about the attempt on Hitler's life. July 20th, 1944. The bomb went off, he was injured but not killed. Almost 5,000 people ultimately rounded up and executed. Tell me about that. And we have a great uncle, right? Who was part of that plot, Von Schulenburg.

Volker: Yes. This was - my father had remarried. And this was the German Ambassador to Moscow. Friedrich Werner von der Schulenburg, was old nobility, who was on the list. The Nazis, with typical German efficiency, had typed up a list as to who after the successful coup would run the country. Who would be Chancellor, who would be Secretary of State? Who would be this and this?

Schulenburg was supposed to become the new Secretary of State. When the coup fell apart, when the plot fell apart in Berlin, when Stauffenberg, a day later was executed. And several people died when all this fell apart. He, because Schulenburg was on the list. But he was never - there was never any court, no trial. Hitler was so embarrassed by how many people were part of the plot. These people were quietly executed. All we heard is that he had died of a heart attack. And this was not made public until after the war.

Paul: Dad, my grandmother, Oma - who I met a few times while she was still alive. She was a famous opera singer. Why did she have to stop singing?

Volker: Well opera in Germany was and is a very big thing. Every state capital had an Opera House. My mother was a singer and she was a celebrity. She was invited to all the upper crust get togethers, which included Jewish bankers, Jewish industrialists. And after Hitler came to power, she was visited by some Nazi officials in uniform. Who told her, "Listen, you're a celebrity here, you have to stop associating with Jewish people."

My mother, who was not diplomatic - she was rather outspoken. More or less said, "Do you know who I am? I'm a star at the opera here, and you are beer hall thugs." Which did not go over well. She was almost hauled into court for insulting a German official. Yes, the Germans have a law like that. Anyway, the Opera House was told she had to be fired. Which took place.

She moved to Munich where her sister lived, and one of the first things she did - she went to the Opera House - and the Director there, knew her of course. And said, "Look, we would love to hire you. I can't do it. You are blacklisted. You will never sing in Germany again. If I hire you tomorrow, I'll be out of a job in a week." So she didn't. And we-- But we had to go on living. But she was never incarcerated, but she lost her job.

Paul: Did you have a Stasi file on you? Did everybody have a file? Like talk a little bit about the Stasi. I mean neighbors spying on neighbors, I think American's have trouble wrapping their heads around that, but--

Volker: Every East German had a file. Remember I left in '46. There was still - the Russians were everywhere. They called the shots. East Germany did not officially start until '48 or '49 to become an independent state. No, there was no file on me

After the wall came down, when Germany was united - the Stasi had destroyed some of the files, but not all of them. The East Germans stormed the Stasi headquarters, okay? Nobody was killed, but they kicked out the Stasi people and they got the files. And after the reunification, you had the right to see your own file. Not your neighbors. They had a special government office. You had to identify yourself very carefully, and then you were allowed to see your file of what happened to you.

Here's the case of a father who had wondered why years ago his son was refused admission to the university. He was never allowed to study. In the file it said this “That on the autobahn--" Remember West Germans could mingle and mix with East Germans. We'd been on the autobahn. Admired a guy in a Trabant. This is an aside. I tried to be smart. And we looked under this hood, and said, "This is the engine." Said, "Oh no, this is the air cleaner." "This is the engine." It's with a little 2 stroke about this big. It was like a lawnmower.

Paul: A lawnmower engine.

Volker: I said, "Oh yes, of course." Anyway, the father was observed on the autobahn to have talked with a West German for quite some time. And cordially, and they shook hands. That was recorded by cameras. There were cameras everywhere. They recorded the license plate of the guy. Turned out to be a West German plate, and the license plate of the guy - the East German who talked to the West German. That was a black mark, that which meant his son could not go to university. One encounter on the autobahn with a West German.

And if you, if you want to know – I have another case. Remember Hans Slaughter, my one and only friend? He gave Brett beer to take along. His son became a policeman, an Eastern policeman. Hans Lata also had a brother who lived in West Berlin. Another was the policeman's uncle. If the policeman, if Hans Slaughter son was at home visiting - he didn't live there, he was visiting.

And the phone rung and says, "Hey here, here's Uncle Fritz." Hans Slaughter, the policeman was not allowed to say, "Hang on uncle, I'll get father." If and when he heard his uncle’s voice, he had to disconnect. When he stopped at home, he didn't live there. And he saw his uncles West Berlin car with West Berlin plates. He was not allowed to enter the premises.

Paul: For fear of any, any contact could be used against them.

Volker: Paranoid is the word. Even under Hitler, they weren't that paranoid. Nothing. No contact.

Paul: That memorable night, when The Wall came crashing down, that entire chain of events may have had something to do with reading glasses. One of the official spokesmen for East Germany, not having the reading glasses at the press conference? Remember the press conference, and this individual was asked a question--

Volker: Oh.

Paul: And he didn't have his glasses. I mean, that changed the course of history.

Volker: This was Schabowski

Paul: Schabowski?

Volker: Schabowski - who was Editor in Chief of Neues Deutschland, which was the communist - official communist newspaper of the DDR. That was Günter Schabowski, who-- He came out of a public bureau meeting. There was Honecker, all the biggies. And of course, the pressure had been building, okay?

Schabowski was not in the meeting. Or somebody gave him a little slip, handwritten. Because he had to face a news conference for the western correspondents. Tom Brokaw was one of them, asking tough questions. And it was a mixture of English and German. NBC's top technician in Germany translated for Brokaw.

I don't know if he asked the deciding question. But Brokaw kept asking little by little what happened in the public bureau. Remember, things were at the boiling point, okay? At one point, Schabowski was -- he was not up to reporters asking questions. Not Western style. He was just thrown off by German and English-speaking reporters.

And here was Schabowski. Supposedly he couldn't read his notes, and he didn't have his reading glasses. So he winged it. And there was talk about when to open the border and under what conditions. And I forget who - they were leading him on. And I think the question was, "So would you say that the border is already open today or will be open today?" And Schabowski said something in German, "Yes, I think you could say that," and--

Paul: Oops.

Volker: The public bureau people had gone home. Schabowski was there on his own, amazingly. None of the bigwigs spoke English, okay? So, everything they said went back and forth: German and English. The English-speaking reporters had to be translated. This was hilarious. Some of the border guards who listened on the radio - more or less threw up their hands and opened the border. They weren't supposed to.

One of the officers in charge of the border guards tried to call Honecker, who was in his car. He couldn't reach him, Honecker didn't have a phone in his car.

Paul: Saving money, or they just didn't have car phones?

Volker: They didn't have the technology. Here's the head of a country who could not be reached, because he had no phone. Yet every bakery and every dry cleaner had a phone in his car. Honecker didn't, so he never got word. But yes Schabowski… By the way, he died a few years ago. He turned out to be a fairly decent guy. They stuck him with a job and they went home, and the rest is history. Günter Schabowski. By the way, an educated man.

I met Gisela, my father's blood-sister, on several occasions. She had a sharp edge to her, always annoyed, usually angry about something. That doesn't mean she was a Nazi party member during WWII, but Volker seems to believe she was, and talks about it in this episode.

He also goes on to thank Hungary for allowing East Germans to cross the border in 1989, setting the stage for the Berlin Wall to come tumbling down.

Paul: Tell me the story again about Winston Churchill not wanting to go in and assassinate Hitler. Remember you said Winston Churchill?

Volker: Oh, you mean the one that Churchill vetoed?

Paul: Yeah.

Volker: It was a British Commando who had trained and had planned. And you could not - this was unwritten law. You could not take out the head of a country, even an enemy, without Churchill's okay. Churchill was a Prime Minister.

So, they approached Churchill and said, "The Germans have tried to assassinate Hitler. 2 bombs on 2 different planes didn't go off. And in a beer hall, they had a bomb that went off half an hour after Hitler left. Now we have July the 20th assassination attempt that fell apart. I have them, we have the men. We will take out Hitler. And we have a backup Commando if the first Commando fails. We will guarantee you we're going to get Hitler."

Churchill pondered and said, "I believe you. I believe that you would get Hitler. But if you take out Hitler, one of two things will happen. The Germans will either sue for peace, or the Generals will say, "Finally we got rid of him. Now we can conduct a war the way we wanted to, not the way Hitler wanted," who called himself the greatest strategist of all times.

Churchill says, "If we have number 2 and the Germans continue the war, then we have a much bigger problem than now. Where Hitler makes mistake after mistake after mistake. He's helping us, okay? The war will be over in a year. Churchill was right about it. Let him continue." And they did. That is history.

Paul: How did so many Germans fall under the spell of Hitler? How were so many misled, forso long?

Volker: I don't know. I can say, be facetious and say most of them. Look, in the 20's they had the depression. They had, what do you call it? When your currency goes down to zero, super-inflation. Germany had had various Chancellors. Everybody tried their hand, lasted a few months. Similar to Italy.

Hitler came in and said, "I am stability. Okay, you vote for me, you will have a stable government." There was a lot of attraction. Germany had no democratic history. England and France, yes. The French in 1789, they chopped the heads off of the nobility. The British had hundreds of years of democracy. Germany had 18 years. No, in 1918 - yes, they kicked out the Emperor - who was sent to Holland, became a democracy, okay? So you had from 1918, until Hitler came 1933. That's history.

Hitler promised stability initially. He started the autobahn, okay? He stabilized prices. He didn't come in and - with a broad axe and say, "Okay, now we have a dictatorship." It happened very, very slowly. So, I would say probably most of the people, the common people. The lower, the lower rung – yeah, it's--

Paul: He told them what they wanted to hear.

Volker: Oh yes, absolutely. The parallel with Trump sometimes is frightening. Germany had no protection against a guy like this. He had exceptional powers granted to him by Hindenburg, who was the President. But the German President is a figurehead. He opens bridges and signs decrees. He was in his 80's, he was senile - and Hitler ultimately got everything he wanted.