As this is the final episode of the first season of “How to Smash the Motherhood Penalty”, I wanted to reflect on what I have learnt from taking the leap and making this series. And I also wanted to share what I would do if I had a magic wand. It is a question I have asked all my guests – if they had a magic wand that would make the biggest impact on smashing the motherhood penalty – what would it be? So, it is only fair that I also answer this question. Especially as I have been informed and educated on my answer after listening to all my expert guests in this season.

Thank you for supporting and listening to Season One – please let me know what you have thought about it and if you are keen for more! And what other motherhood penalty smashers I can interview? Who is doing this work that I need to amplify?

I was delighted to be interviewed in this final episode by my daughter Rose. Very appropriate given the purpose of my work is to smash the motherhood penalty so that our children and their children never have to experience it.

I share with Rose what I have learnt so far by making this podcast including:

- Seeing procrastination simply as fear showing up and how to move through it.

- The importance of listening to your whispers as do know what you need.

- The power of stories to help us feel seen.

- Why the phrase “I’m lucky” is one that I wish I did not hear as much as I do.

- My magic wand that will smash gendered caregiving norms. We are not there yet.

- How there can be a cloak of secrecy on what is really happening with work at home.

- Using the words “sotto voce” which I probably pronounce wrong!

- My favourite quote from Anna Funder’s book “Wifedom” which speaks to how complicated work at home gets completed.

- Leaning into hard conversations.

- The power of measuring what men are doing. This is the shift we need.

- Education and support for parents is overdue and needed.

Resources Discussed:

“Atomic Habits” by James Clear – as James says, “motivation often comes after starting”.

“Wifedom: Mrs Orwell’s Invisible Life” by Anna Funder

Connect with Emma

This podcast was funded by Works for Everyone, a business based in NZ and operating globally that supports working parents to stay in the leadership pipeline through coaching, workshops, and advocacy.

Your host, Emma Mclean, is a mother of three teenagers, an Executive Coach and the Founder of Works for Everyone. Following a successful 25-year career in corporate marketing, Emma launched her business in 2019 to put a care wrap around working parents at the hardest time in their career.

She is an Executive Coach, the recipient of the 2022 Jaguar/Viva She Sets the Pace Community

Grant, alumni of the 2021 NZ Leadership Programme, and a Swiftie (a lifelong Taylor Swift fan). 

To work with Emma or enquire about speaking – emma@worksforeveryone.co.nz

www.worksforeveryone.co.nz

https://www.instagram.com/worksforeveryone/

https://www.linkedin.com/in/emma-mclean-9176217/

In this episode we talk with Michelle Russell, General Manager, Talent and Culture, for ANZ NZ and the Pacific. It was a special conversation recorded in the recent school holidays and a unique blend of Michelle’s story long with her observations of the workplace and what is needed to smash the motherhood penalty. She is a fierce supporter of parents continuing to grow their careers and to do it “their way”.

For Michelle, ANZ has been a wonderful place to grow her career over 16 years and become a parent. She has had two experiences of returning to work after parental which we discuss including her return during the global pandemic. Michelle’s insights around the levers that are going to smash the motherhood penalty are powerful and they include disrupting the home norms of caregiving and focusing on the little things at work to help parents feel seen.

Our conversation covers the above and much more:

- The real FOMO of stepping out of the business for 6 months when on parental leave.

- The common theme of having a partner at home or someone who supports your career.

- Being “welcomed back” to work versus “just slotting back in”.

- The importance of “while you away” meetings to help you feel seen. Being conscious of what has changed and letting them know. Little things can make us feel like a fish out of water.

- Generous paid parental leave can minimise the penalty – Kiwisaver and leave accruing.

- The power of a mentor (and conversations that Michelle has) to help you believe that youcan return to the same role – but you can do it differently. “Do it your way”.

- Relationship work allocation falls into a rhythm way before having children. This dynamic needs to change from the start.

- We don’t lean into the shift that needs to happen in relationships when it comes to caregiving.”

- The power of Dads thinking “What could log parental leave do for my career? Not what will I miss out on.

- The home norms are the game changer. Without these – policies will never be fully taken up.

- Have the challenging conversations at home and it will lead to challenging conversations at work.

Resources Discussed

“Untamed” by Glennon Doyle

Connect with Emma

This podcast was funded by Works for Everyone, a business based in NZ and operating globally that supports working parents to stay in the leadership pipeline through coaching, workshops, and advocacy.

Your host, Emma Mclean, is a mother of three teenagers, an Executive Coach and the Founder of Works for Everyone. Following a successful 25-year career in corporate marketing, Emma launched her business in 2019 to put a care wrap around working parents at the hardest time in their career.

She is an Executive Coach, the recipient of the 2022 Jaguar/Viva She Sets the Pace Community Grant, alumni of the 2021 NZ Leadership Programme, and a Swiftie (a lifelong Taylor Swift fan). 

To work with Emma or enquire about speaking – emma@worksforeveryone.co.nz

www.worksforeveryone.co.nz

https://www.instagram.com/worksforeveryone/

https://www.linkedin.com/in/emma-mclean-9176217/

This week, our guest is Charlotte Ward, the Chief People Officer for Kiwibank. I reached out to Charlotte when I saw that they had created a part time role for one of their senior leaders when they returned from parental leave. Creating senior roles that can be completed in part time hours is one of the ways we will smash the motherhood penalty. This is how we can continue to build our careers instead of side stepping it. Charlotte very generously shares her story, shines a light on how her family works, and provides observations from her career on how we can re-imagine the workplace so that it works for everyone. 

It is a conversation that I feel lucky to have had and not only because we laughed a lot but because we discussed ideas that included:

• The importance of conversations at home about how caregiving will happen in your family.
• How gender norms start early – even with how dances are taught in primary schools. 
• “Workplaces are built for Don Drapers” and more goodness from Michelle King’s book “The Fix”.
• Whether our definitions of success need to be updated. 
• The stories that women can tell ourselves that by themselves almost penalise us.
• Why we need to question the way the workplace works – and to put a focus on outcomes not time spent at a desk.
• Creating a culture where you feel like you can ask questions.
• Policies alone may not be effective – you need a culture that enables and normalises them.
• Recognising the challenges for managers and people leaders. They need support and need to be equipped to have good conversations. 

Resources Discussed

“The Fix” by Michelle Collins

Connect with Emma

This podcast was funded by Works for Everyone, a business based in NZ and operating globally that supports working parents to stay in the leadership pipeline through coaching, workshops, and advocacy.  

Your host, Emma Mclean, is a mother of three teenagers, an Executive Coach and the Founder of Works for Everyone. Following a successful 25-year career in corporate marketing, Emma launched her business in 2019 to put a care wrap around working parents at the hardest time in their career. She is an Executive Coach,  the recipient of the 2022 Jaguar/Viva She Sets the Pace Community Grant, alumni of the 2021 NZ Leadership Programme, and a Swiftie (a lifelong Taylor Swift fan). 

To work with Emma or enquire about speaking – emma@worksforeveryone.co.nz 

www.worksforeveryone.co.nz

https://www.instagram.com/worksforeveryone/

https://www.linkedin.com/in/emma-mclean-9176217/